Dr. Phil Addresses Viewer Questions About Burke Ramsey Interview

dr-phil-burke-ramsey

 

When I saw the previews for this season of Dr. Phil, there was another interview that I wanted to see with, Terri Horman,  the step mother of Kryon Horman who disappeared in Oregon six years ago. I set my DVR to tape all the new episode so I could watch it whenever it aired. Today was supposed to be a random episode about a husband with a secret, but due to the huge response to the Burke Ramsey interview, they threw together another show and slapped it on the air today. Here are some highlights.

About Burke’s constant smiling. Dr. Phil says, he says it is just anxiety, he is not autistic, he’s not weird, he’s not creepy he is just socially awkward and nervous. He says that because of the circumstances he has been moved around a lot and lived in isolation a lot. He’s not comfortable being on camera.

I can buy that explanation I suppose. Societal norms when it comes to interaction with others is learned through experience. The rituals of out “tribes” are instilled in us with regard to things like personal space and facial reactions. Acceptable responses vary from tribe to tribe. Just the other day I was in line behind a woman from another country who would stand so close to me I could feel her body heat. We were practically touching. Clearly she had a different idea of personal space. I ended up standing in front of my cart in order to get the personal space I needed between us. If Burke’s primary interactions were with his mother, the pageant queen and his father who is also quite smiley, I can see this being his natural demeanor.  But it sure does raise some suspicions.  And I may want a second opinion from someone other than Dr. Phil.

Why did Burke agree to the interview?  Because the 20th anniversary is approaching and he knew it was all about to start again. People were already contacting him for all the numerous shows that are currently airing.


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Was Burke ever considered a suspect? Dr. Phil’s says no. He was only considered a witness.  This is not exactly true. I’ve read and watched police and others saying that the possibility of the parents covering for someone (Burke) was a serious theory under consideration, and perhaps the most likely.  Dr. Phil  condemns the Boulder police and seems adamant that the family is not guilty. He sites Lou Smit who is the guy we see on some of the show climbing through the basement window.

Why did Burke give so many one word answers? Why didn’t you follow up with more questions?  Dr. Phil says because he was not a suspect. He was a nine years old at the time. He says, “not one agency on the face of the globe considers him a suspect. He is also talking about something that happened 20 years ago.

What DNA was found and where and whose was it? He says there was DNA evidence taken from a blood spot on the band of Jon Benet’s  underwear that belonged to an unknown male. He makes it sound like it was blood from an unknown male it was not. the blood was Jon Benet’s and the DNA was touch DNA which could have been there since the garments were constructed in the factory. In 2008,  the touch DNA excluded John and any Ramsey family members.  They presented this information as if the families exclusion from the touch DNA that could have happened at any time prior to the murder meant that they could not have committed the murders.  This is because the inept Boulder Police also took the results that way and issued a statement exonerating the Ramseys and apologized for contributing to their grief by considering both parents AND BURKE (despite what Dr. Phil said) as suspects. For me this was a ridiculous apology not just because the DNA not matching doesn’t mean they couldn’t have murdered Jon Benet,  but also because when  child dies from suspicious injuries in the family home, it is almost always at the hands of a family member. Every news station ran the story that the Ramseys are cleared. Lin Wood got the case moved to the DA’s office and away from the police. Remember the police and the DA disagreed on the Ramsey’s guilt from the beginning. So of course Lin Wood wanted the case out of the police jurisdiction and into the DA’s. The same DA who refused to prosecute even after the grand jury indicted the parents.

Ramsey house snow

 

What about the story about there being no footprints in the snow? Doesn’t that mean someone in the house killed Jon Benet?  There was no snow on the ground. The police are accused of leaking that false statement. The media reported the leak.

Why didn’t the Ramsey’s speak to the police?  They did speak to the police. However, they got a call from a friend that said that the Boulder Police were targeting them and they needed to be careful. So they hired an attorney. Dr.Phil also says that Patsy had a demeanor that didn’t fit with what the community thought a grieving widow should look like. Just like Burke.

What about the bed wetting story?  Dr Phil shows a photo of Jon Benet’s bed that does not appear to be wet. Lin Wood says that there were no urine stains on the bed. Lin Wood says that it was another story put out by the police. He doesn’t mention Burke saying in his interview that the Jon Benet wet the bed.

What about Burke’s voice on the 911 call?  No evidence to support it.

Did Patsy and John take lie detector tests?  Yes but not through Boulder police. They took them multiple times. Patsy’s first one was inconclusive but they passed the others.

What about the ransom note? Patsy could not be ruled out as the author of the ransom note. One person called by Lin Wood in a defamation case said that Patsy was a 4.5 out of 5 of being ELIMINATED.  This was an expert higher by the Ramsey’s attorney.

What about the sexual abuse allegations?  There was never a formal finding that she was sexually abused. There is no finding in the autopsy of previous sexual abuse. There was evidence of vaginal trauma from the night that she died. Dr. Phil goes on to say “probably from the paintbrush” but this is not something mentioned in the autopsy. Jon Benet’s doctor has stated numerous times he had never seen evidence of any sexual abuse.

What is Burke like when he is not on camera?  Dr. Phil says “he’s happy.” We see more footage of him smiling. He is a computer programmer who works remotely from his home. He keeps to himself. He has a girlfriend.  From a psychological perspective, Dr. Phil says that he has had no unusual instances in his 29 years. No issues with the law. There is nothing unusual about Burke or his demeanor.

On Monday Burke will tell us who he thinks killed Jon Benet.

124 Comments

Filed under Dr. Phil, Entertainment News

124 responses to “Dr. Phil Addresses Viewer Questions About Burke Ramsey Interview

  1. eastjames

    I’ve watched so many different shows and documentaries about this case that the only conclusion that can be made is that the investigation was so botched we will never know what the truth is. I only wanted to comment because the only bit of truth I’ve heard out of all the arm-chair detectives that seems likely is that JonBenet wet herself when she was being killed. To me that is where the “Patsy going Monster Mom” and killing her for bedwetting theory came from.

    • cammierari

      or she wet herself while being tased! That’s what I always think happened. Can’t wait to hear who Burke thinks did it.

      • eastjames

        Thats true….there are a number of things that were discovered in the autopsy that could’ve led to her wetting herself. However, to me it lends to the fact that the Ramseys were tried by the media and victims of a terrible police investigation since somewhere someone got wind of the fact that JonBenet had wet underwear and then ran with it saying that Patsy must have woke up and lost it on her to the point of killing her. (For full disclosure, I do think the Ramseys were/are strange people- hell, if you saw those Christmas videos they’re borderline creepy- but I am of the belief that it was an intruder.)

      • tamaratattles

        Chief Kolar BLOWS AWAY the Scam’s BOGUS “stun gun” theory. The video is an excerpt from his full presentation at the Wilkinson Public Library in Telluride earlier this Fall.

        Finally, SEE WITH YOUR OWN EYES that the prongs of an Air Taser DON’T MATCH the marks on JonBenet’s back. The Air Taser was the closest in proximity to the type of marks on JonBenet that LOU AND DOBERSEN said ONLY matched a Taser. Dr. Stratbucker told Lou in 1997 THAT THE MARKS DIDN’T MATCH, but stubborn old Lou just went shopping until he found someone who said they did. WELL, SEE FOR YOURSELF. Then, as Chief Kolar said, cops always have a PARTNER in cases, and this is the reason why. Chief Kolar showed those marks to a retired cop, who SOLVED what those marks DO match. TRAIN TRACKS found in Burke’s train room, in his bedroom (says Chief Kolar). SEEING IS BELIVING AGAIN, as you can SEE the Boulder Police produced video “one on one” as Chief Kolar described it, MATCHING PERFECTLY THE MARKS AND SPACING ON JONBENET’S BACK.

        THIS IS A HUGE FIND, that goes straight to the heart of the Scams intruder theory. And it’s OBVIOUS as I posted many times through the years WHY the Scams NEVER publicly released their “stun gun” pig testing results to the scientific community, UNLIKE THE GERRY BOGGS CASE. Because, because, because, the first thing any Medical Examiner or Doctor is going to do is MEASURE those prongs distance on an Air Taser and COMPARE THEM to the marks on JonBenet’s body, AND FIND OUT QUICKLY THOSE MARKS DON’T MATCH AND COULD NOT HAVE COME FROM A TASER.

      • Toddy

        Chief Kolar’s book, Foreign Faction, is a must read. If you have Kindle Unlimited, it’s free right now. He lays out the intruder theory (and its many holes) and says he tried to get the DA to revisit the family cover up theory (DA would not). The Ramsey’s lawyered up and denied investigators access to medical records. Kolar thought medical records – especially Burke’s – might help solve the murder.

      • Shay

        Toddy, it’s interesting that both Chief Kolar and Chief Beckner say no intruder, yes cover up, yes Burke. Did Kolar also hint Patsy wrote the ransom note and John didn’t know shit? Both also seem to hint the DA protected the Ramseys and the police weren’t able to do their jobs investigating because of that.
        I’m not going to read the book– too many grotesque details already for me. Was there anything else in the book that stood out to you? (Please no vivid descriptions of the crime scene or autopsy, etc.) Thanks!

      • Toddy

        Shay, I didn’t remember a lot of the details from when the crime happened, so you may know these things. When JB was found and their neighbor Fleet ran into the room yelling, “call an ambulance” Patsy stayed in the solarium though the other women ran to see, thinking JB was alive. Burke only became uncomfortable during his interview with a psychiatrist when asked about inappropriate touching. Burke had supposedly done some things with feces that I’d rather not describe here, maybe suggesting some emotional disturbance according to Kolar. Also, the basement window had been broken for months. Patsy told a friend they hadn’t fixed it and John had used it several times to get in when forgetting keys. Then after the murder, the Ramsey’s ran the wondow’s picture in the paper. The friend was uncomfortable with this as she felt the Ramsey’s were being deceptive with the ad and she and her husband terminated their friendship shortly after. For all the Ramsey complaints about the police, it seems that they had sympathizers both in the PD and DA’s office, according to this book. I believe another friend said John wanted his golf clubs retrieved from the house during the investigation and she thought it odd as it was winter. It made her wonder if there was something incriminating in the bag. I wondered why the Ramsey’s insisted that JB was asleep when arriving home from party. Autopsy found undigested pineapple. A bowl of pineapple in dining room had Patsy’s prints. They established no pineapple was served at party they’d attended. Also, autopsy found prior sexual abuse (though her pediatrician said there was no evidence of it).

      • Toddy

        Also, Kolar’s says Smit was a small man who just fit through that basement window, when he demonstrated it on tv. Kolar lays out what intruder theory would look like and makes it seem highly implausible.

      • Shay

        Thanks, Toddy. Seems like more details, interviews, and evidence that:
        1. The DA was no bueno
        2. No intruder
        3. One or more Ramseys killed her and covered it up
        4. The Ramseys spent all their money, time, energy throwing the scent off themselves instead of helping solve the crime

        As DNA, blood, and fingerprint technology improves daily, I hope they solve this case. And I hope they charge whomever had a hand in the murder, coverup, and/or was an accessory after the fact.

      • angie

        Yay! What the H is wrong with Dr. Phil? Did he not see the prior video interviews with Burke having no emotion and even smiling after his sister’s apparent murder in their own home? So disappointed Dr. Phil. Now we should all know who did this. And nine years old or not? Burke should be evaluated as he cannot be charged. Another one on the loose and Dr. Phil drinking the koolaid. Wake up folks! Thank you for your comments tamaratattles!

      • FIONA

        Dr. Phil and The Ramseys share the same lawyer, Lin Wood. I guess that explains the biased nature to his 4 episode exclusive. Pretty sad when you ignore the evidence like that. Money always talks. Jon and Burke Ramsey should be thrown into jail for the rest of their lives and so should the DA and any other people they paid to keep quiet.

      • AshK

        I thought the train track theory didn’t match, because of the size of the marks on her face..

      • tamaratattles

        Stun Gun theory was put out there by Lou the dude the DA hired to debunk the police force’s investigation. Ever watched Law and Order? The DA does not investigate cases, the police do. The DA does not indict people, Grand juries do. Lin Wood convinced the DA to take over the case using strong arm tactics and bring in someone who would say something beneficial to his client.

        The stun gun theory has been debunked numerous times for numerous reasons. A stun gun does leave two holes on the victim. It leaves burns. A stun gun causes the victim to SCREAM BLOODY MURDER and JBR would have woken up the entire house. The distance between the holes did not match the with of the prongs on the stun gun, but did match the holes of the train track.

        Nearly everything that LOU said was debunked by actual investigator not hired by the DA.

      • cammierari

        Who or what is “the Scam’s”

      • tamaratattles

        ONCE MORE WITH FEELING….The Autopsy showed signs of exterior trauma to the genitals. Investigators presume it was a blow with the paint brush.

        But signs of vaginal trauma and NO EVIDENCE OF HISTORICAL ABUSE.

        Just an exterior mark.

      • Toddy

        Re: abuse — Kolar says signs of previous abuse, in addition to recent vag injury😳 Please don’t put me w/window lickers😱

    • Allison

      I always thought the same thing, she wet herself whennshe was killed. I’m kind of Burke’s out, 4 days is an awful lot to devote to an interview but in get the interest is there. I think, too, that people are expecting an adult response to something that happened as a child, and shaped the rest of his life. By now, he’s used to it for lack of a better term.

  2. Julien

    Dr. Phil should not have been the one to conduct this interview. John Ramsey is the sole killer and has gotten away with murder for 20 years.

    • tamaratattles

      There is ZERO evidence pointing to John. NOTHING. NADA no thing. Also, you should preface things like that with “in my opinion” or you open yourself up to a libel suit. Also, it makes you sound kind of deranged and over invested.

      • Glittergurl

        Well you should use your own advice TT when it comes to accusing a nine year old child. You basically keep trying to convince everyone that Burke killed his sister and his parents covered it up. I’m starting to think you’re evil, miserable or both.

      • tamaratattles

        I would be offended by your thought process if you showed any signs at all of a logical thought process. I suggest you brush up on your thinking skills a bit more before you wander into adult conversations.

        Siblings have been killing each other since Biblical times. Cain killed Abel. You only have to read three chapters in to get to that part. Another well known sibling on sibling murder is documented in Roman mythology in the story of Romulus and Remus to describe the birth of Rome to name a couple of palatable stories from ancient literature.

        A simple Google search, something I suggest you teach yourself to do, but until then I’ll provide with a link that if you think really hard you might be able to point to and click on will take you to a horrifically large number of current homicides involving small children.

        https://www.google.com/search?q=children+who+kill+siblings+%5D&oq=children+who+kill+siblings+%5D&aqs=chrome..69i57.20451j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

        Now run along. The adults are talking.

      • pokerplayer

        Glittergurl, well said, TT is a very miserable, angry, sad person.

      • Cake

        Help me to understand why you make the effort to come here, read, and comment unless you actually enjoy the blog of a miserable and deranged writer.

        Personally, I dont find Tamara to be miserable at all. She just doesn’t tolerate the ramblings of village idiots or fools.

      • Shay

        You need more commas.

      • Allison

        @shay maybe she’s got extra periods to lend the other.

      • Shay

        Maybe we can do arbitrage.

      • Allison

        @shay- arbitrage, whatever it takes, it’s so hard on my brain reading it 😉

      • Cat

        Get it straight. There’s a difference between an OPINION and an outright ACCUSATION. TT is very careful about NOT making accusations in cases like this, and in her blog posts in general. She may have strong opinions, but, hey…don’t we all?

  3. Karebear

    I watched the special that A&E (not sure) on demand on this case it’s very very intriguing I always had the opinion that the parents were involved but now with all the DNA & the intensive digging that Lue Smit did he devoted his retirement up on till his death on this case is astounding. I encourage you all to watch it if you can find it. I now believe that it was an intruder in the house.

    • There has also been a really interesting three part special on Investigative ID channel. There was actually 3 suspects that were looked into. As it ended part two last night the 3rd person looked promising . I don’t want to give anything away but if you get a chance check it out. It was very good New information too. I don’t think it was the Ramseys. But I would be interested to know if any one else saw it.

      • eastjames

        I watched both. They were very interesting and both sides have valid investigation points. What I am having trouble finding now is that someone was saying everyone who has worked the case that was heavily investigating the intruder theory was let go eventually? I know i heard that at some point but, as I commented before, I have watched a ton of docs and crime shows about this case so it’s kind of running together.

      • Linda

        Dr P was totally biased, he should have watched this weeks docuseries on CBS the dream team put together physically tested many theories and the evidence keeps pointing to someone in home.. Why didnt Dr P bring up the golf club incident or his abuse of jbr with feces torture? Let’s start there..

    • Shay

      That DNA is bullshit. The DNA “expert” Eikelenboom (also did Casey Anthony’s trial) was discredited and disbarred as an expert witness: A Denver prosecutor got Eikelenboom to admit that he had no direct DNA extraction or analysis experience, that he operates a lab that has not been accredited, that he personally failed his basic proficiency texts in 2011 and 2012, and admitted that he was a ‘self-trained’ in running DNA profiles,” the DA’s office said.

  4. BeetsWhy

    This was a good episode, the fake audience (employees) asked a couple questions that I also had. I’m traveling on Monday so I’m now reconfiguring things so I am in my hotel room by 4pm to see who Burke thinks did it!

  5. Sharon

    Just an FYI- Burke did not say his sister wet the bed the night she was killed. Dr. Phil asked him if Jonbenet ever wet the bed and Burke said yes and he also said he wet the bed too when he was younger. Dr. Phil then followed up with the question asking if his Mom ever got really angry about her bed wetting and he said no, she would just change the sheets etc. I watched it back to be sure I heard this right.

  6. Eileen

    I’ve always wondered about the man that played Santa during their holiday party.
    * JonBenet told her mom Santa had promised to make a special visit just for her the next night.
    * during the funeral, when he got up to speak, something about what he said or his behavior had made many people uncomfortable.
    * Police ruled him out though saying they didn’t think, due to his health and age,he’d be capable of committing the murder.
    These aren’t my opinions, it was in one of the specials I happened to catch.
    the show must have glossed over the details because I was screaming at my TV wondering why police weren’t digging deeper into Santa!!!!!?
    Does anyone know more about Santa?
    I couldn’t stop thinking a person capable of such a horrific act, could certainly be capable of acting sickly to save his ass.
    If I recall the report said he was in his 60’s at the time.
    AND…if there’s more to the Santa story that excludes him, the show did him a huge disservice since that’s all I could think of after watching

    • eastjames

      I was also skeeved out by Santa guy. In terms of criminal profiling, from what I understand, showing up to the funeral would be something a killer might do. Just like in cases when people have gone missing and the killer has participated in the search party.

    • Shellie

      I watched the ID Channel 3 part series and I believe it was, Santa wrote her a letter saying she’d get a special “surprise” after Christmas. I don’t think it was “visit”.
      Also, he was ruled out as at that time he had recently had open heart surgery (or something like that), and investigators did not believe he could’ve physically committed the crime in his condition.
      Forgive me for any mistakes – there’s been an overabundance of Ramsey on my TV the last few days and it can get a little confusing.

      • Allison

        I’m so glad the dr Phil showed Lou smit climbing through the window that the BPD said no one could climb through. I’ve seen another video of someone showing it could be done as well, and police photos show the smudge on the wall that could be a shoe mark. Because they refused to investigate the intruder theory some in got away with murder. It had to be someone that knew the family and/or the layout. They house was open for a Christmas tour a few days before-the murderer could have very well been there. It could have been someone she was familiar with. I do not buy it was either parent-they are far from seasoned criminals and would have made big evidentiary mistakes. This took planning. Whoever did this went in there to do exactly what they did.

      • tamaratattles

        “This took planning”

        a) No it didn’t
        b) and a random person touring the house just laid out the plan because they had nothing to do before Christmas?

        There is nothing about this case that indicates any planning happened whatso ever. There was the ransom not that was written INSIDE THE HOUSE including one discarded “rough draft” that was quite reminiscent of the movie Ransom that was playing in theaters at the time.

        A kidnapper doesn’t spend hours inside a house full of people writing ransom notes. A murderer or sex offender doesn’t spend hours inside a house killing a small child while the house had three other people in it that could get up at any time.

        There was no DNA or fingerprints other than Patsy’s on the ransom notes or the pineapple or the murder weapon.

        The body of JBR was redressed after the minor assault on her vagina and wrapped in her favorite blanket.

        There was no intruder DNA on the duct tape or the rope.

        There were carpet fibers on Burke’s baseball bat that was places outside from the carpet of the room where Jon Benet was found.

        Burke admits going downstairs to play with “a toy” (train?) after everyone was asleep on Christmas night.

        None of this caused any planning until after Patsy discoverd the dead, or nearly dead child.

        Burke was a boy scout who knew how to tie knots.

        There is nothing that suggests an intruder except an open window that Burke likely went in and out of to retreive and return the baseball bat to the yard…

        There is no evidence to support an intruder.

      • Allison

        The window was opened in the basement and had not been previously. If someone had an unhealthy interest in the child and took advantage of the fact there was a tour of the house, that would get them in. The suitcase was under the window and had not been there earlier. The seasoned homicide detective with a solve rate of like 90%, that was brought in out of retirement by the boulder DA, says there was very likely an intruder. Where’s the duct tape? Other piece of the paintbrush? Not in the house. The DA exonerate the entire family and even apologized for the umbrella of suspicion. I’m sorry but you cannot discount Lou Smit. He has proven the window could have been accessed, and I believe a seasoned homicide detective with no dog in the hunt. Burke didn’t do it, that’s ridiculous. There’s a reason he was never a suspect.

      • tamaratattles

        Oh I can totally discount Lou Smit who was hired by the DA’s office to shout down the police investigation and give her a reason to ignore the grand jury.

        You have a lot of information about when the window was open and when it was not that no one else has.

        There is also the actual fact that the white blanket JBR was wrapped in was left in the dryer by the maid and yet, the person who wrapped her in it got it out of the dryer. One of many facts presented to the grand jury and not the ones you made up in your head.

  7. Christi

    I watched the A&E doc and found it pretty interesting. I thought the stun gun theory was very plausible. I never thought the Ramseys did it. Having strangers parading through your house would be the perfect opportunity for a predator to familiarize themself with the home. I hope someday they can find the person who did this and give that family some peace.

  8. Misha11

    I have to say I’ve changed my opinion about Burke. Thought he may have done it and parents covered but now considering he has never had a problem with the law or any type of abuse issues in his life, I’m leaning more toward the intruder theory as well. AlsoTamara thanks for your recap on this. You are one smart cookie.

  9. Janet

    I didn’t watch the A&E special, but I feel like people’s biases are allways tainting or slanting the evidence in this case. Way too much bull shit that doesn’t match the facts, even though someone wants it to. I take everything with the grain of salt on this case.Dr. Phil included. I still think it was most likely an inside job. Do I want to think that? No. But, It doesn’t fit any reasonable intruder or kidnapping theory to me. I think a sexual predator would kidnap the child and take them to another location to molest and murder at their leisure, and not do all that , when the family is there. I dont see them writing a big long stupid note with the family’s note pad and pen, and with that type of suspicious phrasing. I dont see them using something from the moms hobby set, to use on the child as a garotte,either. How would they have access to that? And lastly, Dr. Phil’s excuse for Burke’s constant grinning, saying it was a nervous grin, doesn’t square with me. My study of facial expressions is, that nervous smiles DON’T fully engage the eyes. Our emotions allways show through our faces. We cant help it. Fear or nervousness, or sadness will show in the eyes or mouth , or eyebrows, and the chin, if even only for a second. We do not look giddy or euphoric, if we are nervous, akward or feeling painful emotions. A big grin with smiling crinkeled eyes, is a happy face. And if he does that just because he’s socially akward from the isolation, why was he doing it back then at the funeral and the police interview as well? I wasnt aware that some isolation made you not have human expressions that we all have universally. That he has a girlfriend means not much either. How many weirdos have girlfriends, most of them. That he’s stayed out of trouble is a plus, but this could be a FAMILY thing, and it’s over. Jon Bonet is no more. Im not saying Burke did anything bad or is guilty, Who knows? We will probably never know the truth of that night. I’m just saying he’s not showing normal emotions. I think this family had ISSUES. It gets to people, because it blasts the heart out of what a family means. So, it’s like we are seeing it through some prism. And why does Dr. Phil now try to excuse away Burke’s grinning, when before he made a point of saying he would leave that up to us how we judged that? Was he threatened or got scared?

  10. GildedLily

    I still believe that someone in the Ramsey family was the killer. The forensic pathologist who performed the autopsy ruled out the stun gun theory. The marks on her skin were 3.4 centimeters apart and the stun gun probes were 2.9 centimeters apart ( or it could have been the other way around) Also, the marks on her body were not consistent with those that would be created by use of a stun gun.

    • Allison

      Everything I’ve seen and read says that a blood droplet from an unknown male was the source of the DNA, the touch DNA in the waistband if her long johns was found years later, but the first source was early on. The taser theory was shown to have been possible, the marks measured perfectly, and they tasted a pig carcass to show what the marks on the skin would look like and measure, and it was the same. That’s what I’ve seen.

      • tamaratattles

        All Blood Evidence is from JBR. DNA testing appears to indicate all blood evidence belongs to JBR. There is “intermingled” DNA with JBR’s bloodspots on the panties, but investigators believe the “foreign” DNA may be saliva or sweat and no one has reported it to be blood.
        Foreign DNA Degraded. The intermingled DNA has been reported as “degraded.”

      • mddc

        There was DNA on her panties that they are still using in the investigation. The DNA evidence suggests it wasn’t someone Caucasian but someone of Hispanic descent.

  11. Lindsay

    Shudder. “Dr.” Phil is such a goddamn ghoul.

  12. CoBe

    Oh, I absolutely believe Burke was the killer. Both with the blunt object to the head AND with the garrotte.

    Although he smiles throughout the interview, at some points, he GLOWS. The smile lights up the room with his glee.

    IN MY OPINION, he is getting a thrill from the attention, he is getting a thrill from the speculation, and he feels very very superior in the knowledge that he got away with it.

    The only thing that would make him happier, IN MY OPINION, would be to see someone else take the fall for this.

    I believe Patsy helped with a cover up in order not to lose another child.

    What a sad situation.

    • Janet

      Dr. Glass described it as “duping delight”. I agree, he appears to be enjoying this interview. Dr. Phil said he was nervous and uncomfortable to be on camera. I dont see that at all. Im a shy person myself, and I know an uncomfortable shy person when I see one. I didn’t see one. I’ve read alot of crime books over the years, ever since someone lent me an Ann Rule book. What people don’t realize is how VERY hard it is to get a murder conviction. Then if there’s wealth and prominence it’s even harder. This crime was not done by a seasoned criminal, that joke of a ramson note for a non kidnapping, was ludicrous . It had a very sloppy staged sense to it. If they changed her clothes there goes the DNA. And of couse a family member would have their DNA around and wouldn’t prove anything unless it was semen or something very incriminating. I still remember my husband telling me when he was in college they went on a tour of a morgue, and talked to the coroner. He said she told them its possible in certain counties for ANYONE to get away with murder. They will not be able to investiagate or solve it, so basically you’re home free it you want to murder someone.

  13. Like the Darlie Routier case, it’s always been clear to me that the Mother did the unfathomable. In both cases, the dynamic with the husbands’ is just as unfathomable as the crime.

    • Allison

      See-don’t get me started on Darlie Routier. For years I thought for sure she was the devil and did it-but now I’m not so sure. Her husband has some very suspicious and questionable shit in his closet-

  14. Cheech

    I strongly, with the utmost respect, suggest that Dr. Phil and everyone else interested in this tragedy read A.James Kolar’s book “Foreign Faction:…” Some info you may not know: A book found in Ramsey’s in master bedroom tells of almost the exact way jon benet’s death was staged. That Burke has many emotional problems prior to this tragedy. I could go on and on. Everything in this book, from the law enforcement official eventually involved in this case is the most comprehensive and concise book I have ever read regarding this subject. Perhaps, unwittingly, Dr. Phil may not realize, but I sure do, and I think this show was nothing but a way to dupe America; I also heard that a lawyer, Lin Wood is both John Ramsey’s and Dr. Phil’s attorney, although I could be wrong. This book is the most logical and most comprehensive book written by the one who knows all the painstakingly researched details of this case and it covers everything, from the political games that went on, etc etc….please read it and come to your own conclusions…all it takes is common sense. No, you don’t need to be rich or have influence over “judicial” officials either! This is clearly an inside job and all the “intruder” nonsense is put to bed. Highly recommended; you will see much more clearly than all of the maneuverings and smoke and mirrors and misinformation that has been put out to the public. I hope that if, in fact, the conclusion you will likely reach is the same and that this individual tells the truth one day…but I sure won’t hold my breath! RIP JonBenet may you have true justice one day! P.S. The author does not exactly reveal who he believes (knows) who killed JonBenet and, I am only speculating as to his reason, that to reveal too much may jeopardize him due to the fact that Ramsey’s influence, etc.have engaged in lawsuits. The Ramsey’s are rich; the author is not and used his own money, his retirement, to get this book written/published and he just could not hold this information and his findings and sleep at night! These reasons for his neglect to actually state the killer’s name by the author is strictly my opinion only. This “opinion” and conclusion has been reached by many, many, many people…I just hope this post will get published here and apologize if I’ve offended anyone which is not my intent, but I believe all information should be researched and people come to their own conclusions and, yes, I know that others will have a different opinion and that’s fine and I certainly respect them. I just hope someday the killer confesses; JonBenet deserves it!

    • tamaratattles

      I believe I quoted Kolar somewhere here in the wee hours. I thought he was listed as a former police chief?

    • Janet

      Yes I remember that phrase in that totally BIZARRE fake ransom note, about claiming to be a member of a foreign faction. I was alot younger then, and that still sounded dubious then. I didn’t know about that book, but I’m going to read it now. When I was a teenager growing up in a small town we had two middle class family murders. One who killed his wife and got a slap on the wrist because she was having an affair. And another a dad who killed his beautiful teenage daughter, but it was never even investigated. He was an abusive husband but the wife wouldn’t report it, and her physician dad couldn’t get her to leave him. Neighbors looked the other way and nobody liked him. I saw the wife one time in town as a kid and she was black and blue all over. The girl was tapped by a car one night coming from visiting a boyfriend and was released from the hospital pretty quickly. She died that night and a million stories were bandied about to make us feel better about it. Some stories said she fell from a hay stack and landed on a pitch fork about three oclock in the morning. The obituary listed her death from EXTENSIVE head and chest injuries. My cousin who was a young nurse at the time said those injuries would never have allowed her to leave the hospital. They would have killed her right then and there, and she couldnt have moved. They didn’t happen from that car barely touching her. The dad I believe and others did too, killed her, because she was getting a ton of attention due to her budding beauty. She had been a cute chubby kid who had recently blossomed into a gorgeous young lady. The guys were showing interest and dad was not happy. He was losing control. Anyway, I remember the denial alot of people had and they wanted to put a pretty spin on an ugly story. Also, some people are scard when they see a monster and would rather ignore it. I allways want truth and justice when a tragedy that shouldn’t have happened, happens. But not everyone does.

    • Nicole Olson

      Cheech, totally agreed 100% Thank you!!

  15. cheychey

    I just can’t with the intruder belief. I find it to hard to believe that an intruder went around the house searching for a pad and pen to write a note. Also a random intruder knew how much John was getting for his Christmas bonus? Some deviant that wants to murder a child would not write a ransom note. Someone who actually wanted money would not have murdered her in the home. Killers of children statistically kill them somewhere they feel comfortable where they can perform whatever ritual that makes their sick mind feel gratified. How did the killer know which room was JB. Did they go room to room in the middle of the night undetected. Even if Patsy had. Christmas home tour wouldn’t that probably be the main part of the house. Surely a home tour of Christmas decorations wouldn’t include your children’s bedrooms, so how did the intruder know which bedroom was JB’s.

    • Allison

      So it couldn’t possibly be someone who knew the family? Who was possibly “stalking” them? Bonuses are usually public record, no?

      • AshK

        The whole bonus thing made me think it could have been one of his employees. They just hit $1 billion in sales, he gets a huge bonus, which could have set-off a disgruntled employee.

      • tamaratattles

        No. Bonuses are not public record.

      • tamaratattles

        The disgruntled employee would know he got a bonus. But not how much it is. The person who wrote the note, aka Patsy did know the amount. And the bonus had just happened. The person who wrote the note deliberately misspelled basic words but spelled ‘attaché’ correctly right down to the accent mark…

    • The parade of historic homes where I grew up did include the entire house. I grew up in a very large historic home and my mom gave in from time to time and allowed the tour. I don’t know if the same is true for the Ramseys.

      • Allison

        From what reports state she was one of the only people to allow her entire home to be toured. Kids bedrooms, master, everything.

    • tamaratattles

      WHile I agree the intruder theory is beyond ridiculous, Patsy did supposedly leave one of JBR’s gowns and crowns on her bed for the lookie loos.

  16. Anna

    I’m with you T…. 100%. Parents totally covered up the account …. period .

  17. jayd

    Why no lie detector dr Phil? The one they took in the past was given by their lawyers. If I were innocent of this crime I would say dr Phil let’s do a lie detector now. I’m sure it was part of the deal right dr Phil? Where’s Maury?

  18. Leann

    Did anyone else catch that Burke had went downstairs at sone point during the night to look at a present? I’m wondering if JBR followed him down & he was try to keep her quiet so he “accidently” pushed her or hit her somehow that caused her death?

  19. I am with Tamara on this one. She does her homework. You can slant things anyway you like but the evidence slants the most towards John. I just wish someone could get him to admit it. Maybe put him in a room with TT?

    • mddc

      I don’t know what evidence you’re talking about because all of the valid evidence that’s been put forth has indicated it was an intruder, no doubt.

    • tamaratattles

      I don’t think John had anything to do with anything. I do believe he figured out what happened at some point. But I don’t think he knew anything when he found her. The police said that John and Patsy seemed very distant during most of their investigation.

      I say Burke did it and Patsy covered it up and wrote the ransom note.

    • Allison

      @debra w-e. Seriously? Put him in a room with TT? I adore Tamara but brown nose much?

  20. Pam

    I always thought there was a cover up. I think Patsy wrote the note but I never believed she killed her. Burke makes sense now but I don’t want to believe that either. I thought the cover up had to do with the dad finding JBR before he called the cops and because she was found in the house he knew they would be suspects and so the cover up began…It still never made sense though. NONE OF IT. Dr. Phil has to be careful with how he answers these questions. He can’t tell us “yes!! Burke did it” because he would get sued. No pedophile murderer is going to risk getting caught by assaulting and killing the child in the house where they live. It never happens. This case is driving me crazy. Where are the psychics when you need them?? I’ve you tubed psychics and nobody seems to know anything. ugh.

  21. As far as Lou Smit is concerned, I seem to recall that his judgement may have become clouded by the fact that the Ramsey family was wealthy, very prestigious, and, both Smit and the Ramseys were active in the Christian community. He found it impossible to believe that a family of such high moral standards, like himself, and one that enjoyed an extremely monied position (he enjoyed rubbing shoulders with the wealthy Ramseys) could have commited this heinous crime. As history has shown, however, Christians are perfectly capable of murder so rare. Also, having mega cash doesn’t prevent human beings, fallible as we all are, from killing — or any indiscretion for that matter. Money does help to buy the best lawyers, however, and it does tend to leave a favorable opinion of those who possess it; money and status makes it much easier for potential suspects to seduce LE into a false impression of innocense — which is precisely what happened on the morning of December 26, 1996, when detectives arrived at the Ramsey residence and what lead to the initial bungling of the investigation. So, you could say that Lou Smit did, indeed, have a “dog in the fight,” and a big one at that.

    • Janet

      Ive felt there was bias and favortism. So that explains it. No smoking gun has exoneriated the family, despite it being labeled as such recently. Nothing has come out new that proved they couldnt have done it. That’s when I knew someone was trying to FIX this for the Ramsey family and the FIX was in. My in laws had a friend who NEVER would believe Scott Petersen killed his wife. Not even after his conviction. You know why? Because he had belonged to her country club in Modesto and he was GOOD LOOKING she thought. Nothing would persuade her otherwise and my in-laws just shook their head in amazement.

  22. Spunky2015

    I believe someone was in and out of that house for a long time and became very familiar. Intruder could of easily taken a note pad and written prior with latex gloves on. He was probably in that house all Xmas day. I believe it was an elaborate setup to make John look guilty.

    • Also, saw the movie “Sully” with Tom Hanks the other day (good movie). When the NTSB questioned Sully on how it was unprecedented that a plane landed without casualties on water Sully said “there has to be a first time for everything.” So with the Ramsey’s I think this is the case too.

      Elizabeth Smart was taken from her home while everyone was asleep meaning anything is possible.

  23. Observer2

    How would a 9-year-old boy know how to make, much less use a garrot (sp?) No cub scout I know has that kind of training.

    • Bird

      “Garrote” has always bothered me. Yes, the knots “look” intricate, but it was not used as a garrote is designed. Like someone saw a pic and copied it.

    • @Observer2: Really. JBR wrists had a pretty intricate knotting there.

    • Pam

      john was in the navy. I think Patsy was too. If this was indeed Burke who did this and the parents made it look like something different??? hell, idk…Idk what happened but dad could have taught burke lots of things like tying knots maybe??

      • tamaratattles

        John was a civil engineer in the navy in the sixties. He was not tying knots but rather working in an office onshore working on designs and maintenance of the on shore facilities.

        Oh and your beliefs that Patsy was in the navy are hysterical.

      • Pam

        Did John go through basic training? He knew how to tie those knots. lol Maybe I should have put a question mark after I said “I THINK Patsy was in the navy?” I never said I believed it. It was something I read somewhere. I should have added “but I’m not sure” onto it or something…lol If Burke couldn’t tie those nots (OP) from boy scouts then that leaves 2 people and only one apparently could do it. I’m just guessing like everyone else. I was trying to feel in the blanks because I want the puzzle solved.

      • tamaratattles

        Pam, clearly you do not know what a civil engineer does. Or that the navy employees many people whose job is not “knot tying sailor.” Or what happens in basic training (hint, it’s not Knot Typing 101, that’s the Boy Scouts)

        Please read the commenting rules. Particularly about “THINGS I READ SOMEWHERE.”

        And then sit down and shut up.

    • tamaratattles

      How many cub scouts do you know?

      • Allison

        CEO bonuses and salaries are public. You can look any of them up. I think it has to do w the SEC or something like that but in any case…

      • tamaratattles

        I’m CEO of TamaraTattles Media, LLC what was my Christmas bonus last year? How about the CEO of Piggly Wiggly? What was his? How about Andy Cohen?

      • Allison

        Federal law and SEC regs require the dollar value of compensation among top senior executives to be included in the annual public filings of the corporation.

      • tamaratattles

        Public filings. John, company was not publically traded. And the murder happened on Christmas day, so even if it did have to be publicly filed as a subsidiary of Lockheed, it would not have been filed on fucking Christmas day! HE JUST GOT THE CHECK. YOU KNOW WHO KNEW HOW MUCH IT AS FOR? PATSY.

      • Allison

        Right right- don’t bash your head against the wall, I agree with you-you just said that compensation packages aren’t public is all and they are- just obviously not in the Ramsey case because whatever. I get it- just pointing out one aspect of salary packages. And with that, since your patience with me is almost gone-I’m shutting up.

      • Observer2

        TT, I know a ton of cub scouts.

      • tamaratattles

        Then ask them to show you their knot tying. They should at least know the first six basic knots. The overachievers will know a dozen. Of course this was back when boys actually participated in such things and weren’t playing Pokemon Go and flying drones into FAA airspace.

  24. Bird

    Burke obviously did it. He is the only one that doesn’t need some elaborate story to tie all this together. He has admitted being up that night and “maybe” he and Jonbenet had pineapple. And “maybe” he used that flashlight that night. Being up playing that night destroys the intruder theory and every thing after that can be explained as a cover up to shield their remaining child. Nothing else fits.

  25. Harleigh

    I have taken several classes which cited this case in my 20+ years of law enforcement. I took a week long class once that studied everything from the evidence to the Ramsey’s body language during interviews. The opinion in every class (or case study ) has always been that Patsy was the killer. Main motive being she felt she was losing control of her daughter because she was growing up.
    I personally always thought it was Burke. I don’t believe the intruder story at all, it doesn’t make any sense.

  26. Rachel

    Hello Tamara, this is my second time commenting on this website. I just love reading your recaps and am thrilled that you covered this subject manner. I work in a neurocritical care unit and we all love talking about this case. We all read chief Kolar’s book and discuss in active debates, but a couple of things remains clear to us. (in our opinion)There was no intruder and the head injury clearly was first. I don’t understand how there are some documentaries that try to dispel the head injury being first, that’s how brain bleeds work, based on how swollen the brain as well as how much blood there is we can approximate how old the bleed is. Not to mention other overwhelming evidence that suggest strangulation was second. As for the intruder theory, it is hard to believe that an intruder waits in the house for the family to go to bed. The intruder then grabbed Jonbenet from her bed (with burke just down the hall) and took her down stairs and fed her pineapple (not canned pineapple, but fresh pineapple) then they hit her in the head and took her down to the basement and set her in a room hardly anyone knew about. Then took Patsy’s paint brush from her art supplies as well as duct tape (from somewhere in the house) and fashioned a garrote, restraints, and duct taped her mouth.Then they went back upstairs from the basement grabbed Patsy’s pen and note pad and began writing the ransom note, scrapped it and redid it to make it 2.5 pages long.(and only asked for 118,000) They placed the pen back where it belonged and placed the ransom note on the stairs that the Ramsey’s used (odd place to put a Ransom note unless you know they use those stairs), then went back down into the basement and finished Jonbenet off? And then went upstairs to the 2nd floor and grabbed Jonbenet’s favorite nighty and went back down into the basement and placed it next to her body (45-2hrs passed where she was alive and her head was bleeding) then they exited? Very odd? Did I miss anything?

    • Bird

      There was very little external head trauma as well as no blood in the ear canals. It was also said she was strangled twice. I took this to mean that she was strangled near death, slowing circulation, then hit on the head (perhaps after coming to and realizing what’s happening to her) followed by anot her strangulation later. Would this fit the evidence?

      • Allison

        You know, I always wondered about that-head wounds bleed-a lot. I’d think a crack on the head that hard would have left scalp trauma but I’ve heard nothing about bleeding from that head injury, which is rather odd, unless the scenario you described had something to do with it, the lack of good circulation.

      • Rachel

        Brain bleeds don’t necessarily leave visible trauma? I’m confused by bleeding in the ear canals, are you suggesting the trauma happened in the temporal region? I took it to be the frontal/parietal region? I’m not sure I get your question? I’ve seen plenty of traumas where someone has fallen hit their head and had a massive bleed.. infact many have died from trauma to the head that you wouldn’t be able to find other then MRI or CT scan.

      • Shay

        Rachel, I agree. I have a brain tumor that hemorrhages and it can only be seen on MRI. The radiologist can even tell if its old or new blood. CT scans won’t show it because it’s a slow leak and not squirting.

      • Shay

        B.T.Dubs, it’s from a car accident– so it is from trauma.

  27. TAMARA

    My opinion is that Burke killed her. Patsy found out and then covered it up. It was a horribly botched job by the police department. The DA was shitty. It garnered too much publicity for everyone and it wasn’t handled correctly by anyone basically.

    My only other observation/opinion is I wonder if Burke truly believes what he says. I can only imagine the “brainwashing” he received at Patsy’s hands. I mean she must have told him he same lies over and over again hoping he’d never say anything. So did he finally believe her events of that night to be true. I know that thought sounds crazy or far fetched but I’m not sure how else to explain what I’m trying to say. Is it somewhat of a stockholm syndrome behavior he has. And before anyone jumps my shit,yes I know Stockholm syndrome is mainly us d to describe victims and their relationship with their kidnappers. It’s also described as a form of traumatic bonding.

  28. Cat

    So….Dr. Phil is now backtracking? He always does this in his “exclusive” interviews, and in his show in general. He never wants to commit to HIS opinion.

    Maybe that’s the smart thing to do?

    As for Burke’s constant smiling…I still find it creepy. It reminds me of my Disney training. And as someone who now avoids public contact, I use my Disney smile as a defense mechanism. When I’m in public, and want people to leave me alone, I switch to “Disney mode”.

    It can be quite disturbing. :)

    In my opinion, I think Burke did it. And Patsy covered it up. Then John defended Patsy. Family protecting family. Or, what remained of the family.

    And I agree, there is a first time for everything. A clean record does not mean you will never snap. Trust me.

  29. MajorIntrigue

    Maybe I missed this, but what I haven’t seen discussed yet anywhere is that Burke states he went back downstairs to assemble his toy after everyone was in bed. If this is true, then why would he not hear or encounter an intruder during that time or upon return to bed? One can assume he was downstairs a while – he said he wanted to “get this thing out”. I don’t think a 9yr old could realistically take her to the basement, fashion a garrote and strangle her though. But I do wonder about whether JonBenet could have woken up also and joined him downstairs and eaten pineapple late night and something happened such as them getting into a fight. But this doesn’t explain the closely matching stun gun marks either that really don’t appear to be train tracks. And why would Patsy wear the same clothes as all day before when starting her day at 5am and yes, the amount in the note is too coincidental. These are all the main suspicious aspects to me.

    • TiosBlankie

      I am more curious as to why he so vividly remembers wanting to play with this toy but didn’t say what toy it was. That just makes the train thing even more suspicious. Why didn’t Dr.Phil ask what the toy was? I really don’t know what to think.

  30. tamaratattles

    New show on CBS tonight starts at “8:30” but probably will be late on East Coast. I may hit some hightlights of it in a post if I am up to it.

    • Observer2

      Tamara, take care please. We all appreciate the insightful posts you make, but you definitely need to take good care of yourself.

    • Cat

      I watched it. Fascinating. Much better than the Dr. Phil interview.

      Maybe you can give yourself a break, and just post the topic for discussion, like Urethra does with AHS?

      I’m not being sarcastic, but serious. Those who watched the show can discuss the details in comments. That way, you don’t have to rehash the whole thing. There was a LOT of info there. That’s a lot for one person to cover.

      Those who did not watch will get enough in comment discussion.

      You can even use this post to discuss it. When I didn’t see a recap, I came here, since it was still topic related.

      Just a suggestion. I’d rather hear that you took a much deserved break.

  31. Gramsof12

    Burke did it. John dictated the ransom note to Patsy who wrote it. They covered up to protect their son. End of story, no intruder. So sad.

  32. VA

    I don’t know much about the murder, only what I’ve been told. I never wanted to do any research into it. But I know this family. They are wonderful people. Patsy was such a funny, wonderful woman. As a child B was utterly normal. There is nothing in the family dynamic that would remotely leave anyone who knew them to even entertain the idea that anyone had anything to do with her death. Patsy was a wonderful mother. I’m sure she’s very proud of her son.

    • Shay

      Have you ever met a murderer? I’ve worked with many violent teen felons. They were all sweethearts. I don’t think all murderers are cross-eyed creepy people.
      Quick story. One of my kids violated parole and got locked up. I asked what happened and he told me he got into a fight at a taco shop. I thought that was so unfortunate because he had just passed the high school exit exam and we got him scholarships to college.

      I went to his parole officer and asked how I could help, what happened, etc. His parole officer told me he was in line at a taco shop and thought a GIRL behind him was talking about him. He stabbed her in the face multiple times. My point is, you don’t really know what someone is capable of or what their triggers are.

      • Cat

        So true. No matter how close you are to the family, if you are NOT family, you have no idea of what goes on when you are not there.

        Some of the most dysfunctional families present as the Cleaver or Brady family.

  33. sandra

    Dr.Phil should have offered Burke a lie detector test like he does all other guests.

    • tamaratattles

      Um he doesn’t put all his other guests on lie detector tests. I think you are thinking of Maury Pauvitch. Burke was not on his show to be outted for some sort of involvement. He was was a guest who was a child when his sister was murderer. Dr. Phil is not the police, or Maury, he’s a talk show host.

  34. JudtJenn

    When you compare this to the Avery story it just goes to show what money and community clout gets you in the legal/judicial system. Two botched investigations for very different reasons.

    • MajorIntrigue

      can we honestly say we would be having anywhere near this level of intrigue, investigation etc if all the circumstances were the same, but it was a non-white family

      • tamaratattles

        If it was a non white family, or a non rich family for that matter, someone from the family would have gone to jail the day the cops arrived.

        The whole reason this is talked about so much is because there was a HUGE coverup and not just from the family.

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